The good fight

Larry Weiser’s first job out of college was driving a taxi in Boston.

“When customers got my cab,” he recalled, “I didn’t know whether they were a judge or a drug dealer. That human contact was fascinating.”

As it turned out, driving a cab was also good training for his subsequent career as an attorney.

“Both jobs are all about people,” Weiser observed. “When clients walk through the door, you don’t know who they are or where they want to go – their goals. But your job is to help them reach their destination.”

On May 31, Weiser will reach a destination of his own – retirement – and step down from his post as director of University Legal Assistance, better known as the Gonzaga law clinic.

The clinic, which recently celebrated its 40th anniversary, is essentially a large, nonprofit law firm, with 40 to 60 students and a small staff of professional lawyers handling hundreds of cases a year for low-income clients.

The students take on a wide range of issues, from elder law, taxes and mortgage mediation to environmental concerns, consumer protection and Indian law.

As he packed up almost 35 years of memories, Weiser paused to reflect on how far the clinic has come, the challenge of falling law school enrollment, and how he plans to spend his spare time.

S-R: Where did you grow up?

Weiser: In Fall River, Massachusetts, a town of 100,000 about 50 miles south of Boston.

S-R: What were your interests?

Weiser: I started playing clarinet when I was 8 and was playing in bands by the time I was 12. I also loved to go sailing.

S-R: Did you envision a particular career for yourself?

Weiser: My dad was a physician and always wanted me to be a doctor, but I was torn between medicine and music. My college degree was in biology and psychology.

S-R: Then what?

Weiser: I drove a taxi in Boston for a year and had a blast. The diversity of customers was a real eye-opener for me.

S-R: What drew you to the law?

Weiser: I knew I didn’t want to be a doctor – I can’t stand the sight of blood. I considered environmental science, but I had this great professor at Boston University – Howard Zinn, the author of “A People’s History of the United States” – and he convinced me I could have more impact on the environment as a lawyer than as a scientist. Later while traveling out West, I came upon Gonzaga Law School and enrolled.

S-R: But you shifted away from environmental law?

Weiser: My first job after graduation was with Spokane Legal Service representing low-income people, and I discovered I liked that. I worked in the Colville office for several years, then moved on to Evergreen Legal Services in Mount Vernon, where I focused on housing, family law and public entitlements.

S-R: What brought you back to Spokane?

Weiser: I was in the first class that participated in the clinical law program created by Mark Wilson and Jeff Hartje. I really liked they way they taught students to practice law, and asked them to let me know if they ever needed any help with the clinic. About five years later, Mark called and offered me a job as the supervising attorney for elder law. I happened to be dating this Spokane woman – Ellee, my future wife – so everything fell into place.

S-R: How has the law clinic evolved since its creation in 1975?

Weiser: Forty years ago, experiential learning for law students was almost nonexistent. The idea behind the clinic was to give students the sort of hands-on experience they normally didn’t get until after graduation. We were given a lot of responsibility but were backed up by supervising attorneys. It was a new concept, and some of the law school faculty didn’t agree with what we were doing.

S-R: But it gradually caught on?

Weiser: Yes. When John Clute was dean in the 1990s, he appreciated what we were doing – especially when an ABA (American Bar Association) review cited our clinic as one of the best in the country. That’s when the law clinic program was integrated into the curriculum, and I went from an instructor to faculty. Five years ago, experiential learning – either law clinic or an externship – became mandatory for graduation from Gonzaga, and today all law schools require experiential learning.

S-R: How well do students handle real-life legal situations?

Weiser: I call it the inefficient practice of law. Students have to work extra hard, but oftentimes they’re more prepared than the professional attorneys. And as the students learn, they also provide a service to the community, which is part of the Jesuit mission.

S-R: How high up the judicial ladder do some of their cases go?

Weiser: We’ve had students argue in the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, the state Supreme Court – everywhere except the U.S. Supreme Court.

S-R: Is the clinic similar to a private law firm?

Weiser: We are a law firm, and subject to all the regulations and confidentiality rules they are. And we’re going paperless, so in technological terms we’re above average.

S-R: How does the clinic differ from private law firms?

Weiser: Every semester we get 30 to 40 new students, so we have the challenge of maintaining continuity for cases that continue over multiple semesters.

S-R: Do students mess up?

Weiser: Yes, but that’s the nature of law – there’s never only one way of doing things – and many mistakes are recoverable. But the supervising attorneys look at all letters and briefs going out, and we have systems to prevent things like missed deadlines.

S-R: Do clients pay anything?

Weiser: Our services are free, but clients are responsible for expert fees and other litigation costs.

S-R: What types of cases are most common today?

Weiser: Housing, family law and public entitlements, which is also what we saw 15 years ago.

S-R: Are there cases you decline to accept?

Weiser: If it’s a case where either the client has resources or an attorney will take it on a contingency basis, we pass it on.

S-R: Overall, how has Gonzaga’s law school evolved since you attended as a student four decades ago?

Weiser: In the ’70s, we were a night school that served only local residents. Since then, we’ve become a top-100 law school that matriculates students from all over the country, and a faculty that’s engaged in significant scholarship.

S-R: What did it cost you to go to law school?

Weiser: About $9,000.

S-R: What does a law degree cost today?

Weiser: Tuition for three years is around $100,000, not including scholarships and discounts.

S-R: What’s the trend in enrollment?

Weiser: Law school enrollment is down nationally. The number of people taking the LSAT (Law School Admission Test) has dropped 45 percent in the past five years, and Gonzaga is getting fewer applicants. Three years ago we had 175 students per class; now we’re about 120.

S-R: What caused the downward trend?

Weiser: I think it was a combination of the recession and a wholesale change in the way law is practiced. In the past, firms would hire young lawyers to go through depositions and discovery, and now some of that work is outsourced to other countries. Also, salaries have gone down as the cost of education has gone up, making the profession less attractive.

S-R: How is Gonzaga Law School adjusting?

Weiser: One way is by offering buyouts to senior faculty. That’s why I’m leaving – I accepted a buyout of my tenure.

S-R: What’s the outlook for enrollment?

Weiser: I think it will start rising again. The Washington Bar says 50 percent of the state’s lawyers are over 50, and about 20 percent are over 60. So in the next three or four years, people like me are going to retire in droves, and we’ll need some replacements. Although I don’t think the replacement rate will be 1-to-1.

S-R: What have you liked most about your job?

Weiser: The fact that I’ve been able to pursue my public interest work by teaching students how to practice law.

S-R: What have you liked least?

Weiser: Dealing with bureaucracy.

S-R: What are you most proud of?

Weiser: When former students who went on to successful careers tell me I impacted their lives.

S-R: When you were young, you envisioned a career as a professional musician. Do you regret not taking that path?

Weiser: No. I’ve loved teaching and practicing law, but I’m still making music. I play tenor sax in a reggae rock ’n’ roll band called the Working Spliffs, and I play clarinet in a klezmer band. And now that I’m retiring, I look forward to doing a lot more of that.

S-R: Will you still practice law?

Weiser: I’ll do a little private work. A lot of my friends are asking me elder law questions. I can’t imagine why. (laugh)